Thanksgiving weekend is one of the 4 busiest weekends for Gatlinburg and the National Park. One option could be helicopter fire repellers to repel into the fire and make an assessment of risk. A map posted with the Fire Information sign dated November 27 showed that the park hoped to stopthe fire before it crossed the bottom of drainages on the west, north and east sides, and the Chimney Tops Trail to the south. We may never really know the truth about this situation just as with so many other current and prominent situations. We must change our minds first and then we must change our actions. My prayers are with all of you. Local folks here who have been involved with Park issues have an old saying about the NPS and their mismanagement of historic structures. As the crow flies, thats not far from Gatlinburg and Ive heard of and read about how quickly wildfires spread and how far reaching they can be under dry conditions from drought. He asked them if they had any information on the fire and they told him Youve got nothing to worry about. By this time the wind was blowing hard and strong. It is unfortunate that sometimes a few seek to blame someone so quickly that they miss the opportunity to really get to the root of the causes for those issues in the first place. I knew him when he was at Indiana Dunes National Lake Shore. I wish the Feds had kept the case instead of handing it off to the local DA. I was surprised that we saw no one at the closed Chimneys parking area early morning when we drove by. I appreciate how articulately you described your thoughts. I am a property owner in the Lake of the Ozarks, in Missouri, and oddly enough, had just returned from a trip to Branson, Missouri. All rights reserved. .. bless you all! Accountability! I went back a few years ago and it was completely different. Visited Gatlinburg for the first time in Oct 2016. Intention is important, even in a court of law, intention ways heavily on the sentencing. Lastly, I would after this last election year never ever put stake into social media as any sort of official news, witness accounts or other fact finding mission. This fire was a terrible tragedy and would require tremendous foresight on the part of such people to have kept people from harm and property from destruction, in this case, because people needed to be aware of the likelihood of the imminent danger they were facing if they stayed in Gatlinburg on Monday evening and overnight. We probably wont want to attribute 14 deaths to a non-native insect infestation, but in the end, can we say it exacerbated the situation? James, thank you for that compliment! As citizens we should be aware of all threats we face and expect our leadership to plan ahead as best they can. January 4, 2017 at 5:26 pm The body of a person has been found in the rubble of a fire in downtown Gatlinburg, our ABC affiliate WATE reported Monday. The wind and the low visibility caused by the smoke made it impossible to fly aircraft over the fire. My husband and I were at our house in Gatlinburg, just north of the Park Vista, on the night of the fire. It is this same type of think tank and diversity we need in reaching a host of solutions to our complexity of problems both in this situation and in all others. He asked them how or who we could contact to get emergency information. Who allowed this to happen? I am hopeful that there are enough folks taking note of and keeping a watchful eye out for this situation, so that lies and cover-up will be vetted. 119K views 4 months ago GATLINBURG Many people get worried when they hear the words Gatlinburg and Fire in the same sentence. However, firebe it a wildfire, structure fire, flammable liquid fire or a a bi-nine campfire does not care or worry about budget cuts, staffing issues, political agendas, experienced or inexperienced decision making or other human factors. These things dont come with the same cheap city plans out here in the rural mountainous zones! You cannot predict an outcome of fight first and fast any better than you did letting thousands of property burn and 15 people die. I look forward to seeing the report when it comes out. But the last one, issued at 7 a.m. EST on Sunday by Eric Holweg, did predict strong winds. An in depth investigation should be launched and the (ir)responsible parties identified. Why? because poor, inadequate human decision making allowing basic fire physics, fire chemistry and TIME to align resulting in avoidable death and destruction! I can only say that I had no peace at all whatsoever after the first word I heard of the terrible fire there .. Flies north of fire (s) in TN. Wednesday, November 23, the day the fire started. National Park Service Supervisory Park Ranger (Protection) in The governor needs to hear that, as well. If I had even been in the bathroom or downstairs I wouldve died . The appearance of dead hemlock progression is astounding. We drove west down the parkway. Any time our community suffers a great loss or devastation like this, it impacts everybody, she said. It is good to question everything, all is not as it appears. Years ago, the NPS wasnt maintaining the churches in Cades Cove of the Smokies. Visibility was so low that other car lights could barely be seen from oncoming cars. I got out of the car and walked up to the side of the pickup truck. Just the mechanics of this devastating wildfire without any editorial comments. Gatlinburg Fire 2016: How It Happened & the Aftermath - PigeonForge.com You have my utmost respect for firefighting; and Ive recently addressed a firefighter who was an apparent spokesman for the local media patty-caking. Published: Oct. 11, 2022 at 5:31 PM PDT GATLINBURG, Tenn. (WVLT) - Four downtown Gatlinburg businesses are picking up the pieces after a fire Sunday morning destroyed their building. By being so quick to lynch people we have created a fear of decision-making and a paralysis of critical thinking. It is written by Stephanie Sweeney, whose house was off the Spur between Gatlinburg and Pigeon Forge. Thank you for the timeline and the opportunity for comments. It was hard to drive because of falling leaves, branches, smoke, wind, and nerves. If their destination is not lit, they have to land there no later than 30 minutes after sunset. It is a sad state of affairs, the loss of life was quite avoidable. Period. I hear of those who didnt leave until 9:00 that night. I think wildland fire managers should be commended that this fire did not result in a tragic firefighter incident like Yarnell Hills. Sevier County remains Smokies Strong 5 years after wildfires - WBIR.com they if you limit that to local staff might not have as much fire management experience as say Yosemite or Yellowstone. You cannot sit and watch a fire in the mountains this close to a town and not call in lots of HELP!!! This makes no logical sense. Most of those resources were involved in those ongoing fires and unavailable for immediate response to a small fire, when it was still small. Our place was gone. I learned so much from the Incident Management Team websites for the various big fires in the mountains (Cohuttas, Joyce Kilmer, Standing Indian, Boteler, Tellico, Party Rock, Pinnacle Mountain). In wildfire-riddled Tennessee, climate change is a hot topic Watch the pride and ego firefighters: youll never outmatch Gods elements. Report: Gatlinburg fire caused $7 million in damages Theres no guarantees that putting a couple hotshot crews with good air support on that fire earlier could have prevented this tragedy, but that would have been more defensible. I cannot count how many times my wife or I would find a fire smoldering typically from someone who flipped a lit cigarette and the brush when they were finished. It seems to me that the extreme wind was as unprecedented as the drought and the low stream levels. Even the Gatlinburg Fire Chief had been told on Sunday at 0900 that models had the fire hitting downtown Gatlinburg by Tuesday 1100. Gatlinburg fire 10/9/2022: One body found after Parkway blaze Corker and Alexander know what would happen if they tried to interfere with a Federal prosecution! In a time in which the NPS and all other government agencies are under attack and certain factions are seeking to replace all our government agencies with private for profit industry I would not ignore the possibility of anything. I am thankful so many are not only opening their eyes here, but taking action and questioning. Lose their jobs over this? I asked my husband to go outside and hook up the water hose we had disconnected for winter. What Caused the Gatlinburg Fire of 2016? Here's the Real Story I am just saying that it is not necessary to lynch someone in order to hold them accountable. She may have chosen poor timing, and perhaps not the best method of tackling the issues, but nonetheless we need to start asking the tough questions without being so offended and then take a good hard look at the issues, and how they can be resolved. Visibility was bad and it was hard to breathe as we unpacked our truck. Asked if I knew if there were any other people down in that area. I wish some barracuda Attorney would take this on and represent the property owners in a lawsuit to try to recuperate some of our losses, any takers? If they do work as a pair, do they set multiple fires in the same area? Sorry to hear that you lost your house, but you followed your wits which kept you from getting stuck there by downed trees over the road. With the drought conditions this would have acted as a flammable liquid would with explosive ignition and then been carried easily by the prevailing strong winds. The age of information is both eye opening and scary, the potential for manipulation is astounding! Kids should be charged and pay a price but so do several officials in the good old boy still lives on in the town of Gatlinburg. Especially our local emergency workers and the Park Service. Since November 29 it has rained about every 2 to 3 daysin the Gatlinburg area. I did blast him; and though I do have the utmost respect for his firefighting endeavors; it it disheartening to see someone with this apparent degree of experience claim this Chimney Tops Fire look at both fires was unpredictable. FEMA did say they would give us a low interest rate loan, we dont want a loan we worked hard and paid it off and dont want to go in debt to rebuild! He replied to me on Christmas Eve no less, that they were double checking all the facts to make sure all of their information was as accurate as possible and would keep digging. Gatlinburg Fire 2016: The Start. Being an avid mountain hiker, I had seen evidence of fires from decades ago (Graveyard Fields being a macro example, but most prior fires in the forest were just like the ones this fall floor duff and fallen dead wood). What about helicopters dumping water? Behind the Chimneys is Sugarland Mountain. How about that for arm chair quarter backing. Ive learned so much on this blog over the past 6 weeks about how forest fires are managed and fought and Im most grateful for that. On November 23 when the fire was discovered the KBDI was 599, Molly Schroer, a spokesperson for the IMT told us. It means they eliminated natural causes, such as lightning and volcano eruptions. Back home in West TN, when tornado warnings were active in a particular area there were loud sirens that went off. Published: Dec. 24, 2022 at 10:17 AM PST GATLINBURG, Tenn. (WVLT) - On Friday, Gatlinburg city officials released a report detailing the downtown fire on Oct. 9 that killed one person and injured another. Not because I am a teller of fortune. That night after we arrived home we started getting text from friends showing fires at the Park Vista Hotel, then one from our neighbors across the street, he lives in Knoxville called and said he had been there at 5:30 P.M. this was on the 28th and when he left it was smokey but everything was still fine. Conspiracy, no. I dont understand, but I dont judge. I was struck by the daunting task of creating a viable fire-prevention plan in that area of constant tourist turnover, and the way it is laid-out. This is a failure at the city, county and state levels, as well as top FEMA, leadership. It is likely that spotting did keep the ground fire spreading into the areas where the homes were, and certainly on the southern edge of town it was the primary ignition source, but I am still skeptical that the homes to the north of town were ignited that way. Just a quick comment per above posts. Now he has the benefit of another 60 to 90 days of another investigation before anything officially or otherwise will be said. We were wearing bandanas wrapped around our faces at this point. The next morning we werent allowed to go check on our house because of fires still burning and impassable roads. After action reports with ample opportunity for community input led to better pre-fire management and intra-agency coordination of resources. Whether it be a resources, financial, training, bias, discriminatory, knowledge, failure to support, equipment or other systemic, human, data or other failures; we often seek to put the blame on any one or a few of the workers when the real root of the problems lies in systemic, resource or other human interaction issues and decisions made by others seemingly unconnected to the immediate event. Bob had stayed in West TN after Thanksgiving, to work there for a few days before returning home so he wasnt with us. There are three broad categories of conditions that affect the way a wildfire burns: weather, fuels (vegetation), and topography. Their are undoubtedly many many causative factors for any disaster, even the actions, inactions and unintentional actions can be like a snowball rolling down a mountain of snow! The man at the Forestry base told him the winds were predicted to keep getting stronger and to be careful of falling limbs. Can fire experts examine burned areas and decipher the path of natural wildfire from managed ignited fires? Gatlinburg businesses look to rebuild after massive fire. China Bazaar, Puckers Sports Grill, Gifts of Gatlinburg, and Caf 420 were all deemed a complete loss. Not clouding the issues with the intent to take down a person. Join our group. She has given me permission to share it on this site. Crews are currently taking down the China Bazaar and Puckers building. Considering the record of wind gusts between 5-6pm and that the fire had jumped US 441, NPS calling Gburg Fire Dept. They had the same weather forecast information. The aptly named Fire Cherry, Beech and Mtn. High winds were to start soon and rain was 5 hours away as indicated by radar. Here is a question & answer from Bill interviewing Tom Nichols on Wildfire Today: One of the more common errors in judgment you have seen on fires? Not the best plan but the safest. All three incidents have a common denominator. But until the review of the fire is complete and the report is published, I would be careful with a statement like this: The Chimney Tops fire was a wildfire being monitored given limited resources initially because of the many other ongoing fires in the region to which fire-fighting resources were committed. My wife and I hiked to Alum Cave Bluffs Saturday, Nov. 26, while the fire was small up on the Chimneys. Gatlinburg businesses look to rebuild after massive fire Do we need to learn from it. It appears that only TEMA has the authority to give a notice over multiple counties, but they didnt take the lead until Monday night, after the fact. I began to notice people smoking while driving their vehicles when I would be out and about and they would flick burning embers out windows and sometimes throw cigarettes out windows. I have a lot of pictures to share via my blog. We need to question everything and everyone with the same tenacious veracity as the other, but we also need to allow for humans to be human, and engage in the process of learning. Interesting time line, fire discovered about 1730 November 23. Who is watching the back door? This is the way to honor each other and to learn. Gatlinburg fire: Body found in blaze rubble, cause of fire under When I crawled my way up Pinecrest Drive to Wiley Oakley through dense smoke, I saw a Gatlinburg pumper at the top of the hill. I was nervous about it. They have tied their hands and resources through environmental forestry management. The coordination and communication of the Incident Management teams is impressive. This fire as did others around this time had highly predictable potential for massive and rapid spread. A couple of weeks after hearing no hardcore news from Knox News, I wrote the editor asking if the News was still doing hardcore investigation of the fire. What about firefighter safety? Kelly Morgans comments may have been harsh and offensive to some folks; but when government builds a wall; sometimes it takes a loud voice to get their attention. They just sat back and watched it burn. As it turned out the sprinklers were far above affordable means and way outside the parameters quoted by the NFPA for the cost of a standard sprinkler system so we did not get them. Well said, the terrain here is different than a lot of places, even out west. Ms. Schroer told us that additional firefighters were ordered on Sunday. I am positive that for anyone who gives of themselves to protect and serve will forever be haunted by that far more than anyone of us can expect to hold them accountable by lynching. Will Lessons Learned fade into distant short-term US fire management history archives once again. Fire Tears Through Downtown Gatlinburg (TN) Mall; One Person Killed Prayers for Gatlinburg - Fairborn Daily Herald I know that because of my experience, my training, my ongoing learning and situational awareness of a host of related and seemingly unrelated knowledge. When I built a home here just a few years ago and wanted to have a sprinkler system installed, I was told we dont have big wildfires here. Even if the new construction doesnt suffer from the eventual degradation of the old foundation, years after you have rebuilt and want to sell your cabin, due to prior disclosure malls when you tell a prospective buyer that your foundation went through the 100 year fire which burned your foundation at 1400 to 3000 F, only a fool would buy it. The Park Superintendent did not want to risk the lives of NPS fire crews with the Chimney Tops Fire 2; and that is to be respected. Contingency plans for how to evacuate the entire town, regardless of the specific hazard, were not well thought out. Bill thank you the excellent i sight and info that is hard to find publicly. I hope the report gives the reason why the tanker planes were never called in since they are co-managed by the NFS and NPS. The cause of the fire remains under investigation by the GFD, Gatlinburg Police Department and the Tennessee Bureau of Investigation. Collaboration, open thinking and creativeness are key. Report: Gatlinburg fire caused $7 million in damages. I convinced my husband to drive back toward our house to see if we could see the fire. My question to the Deputy Super: If the Chimney Tops Fire 2 of Nov 23rd to 28th, 2016 could not have been extinguished before the winds came; and there was plenty of time to act before the winds came; then how come GSMNP fire crews apparently extinguished the first Chimney Tops Fire of Nov 12/13th, 2016? The NPS investigation team has all this information and everything posted on Wildfire Today and a lot of info that was never made public. We had somewhat of a plan but both agreed that if we had a warning or concern we would leave because of our location and our neighborhood has no fire hydrants. I looked at the NWS Forecast Discussion and told my sister They should order pre-evacuation before the wind gets strong.. We told them the fire was coming. We could smell smoke from the fires in NC for a month before the fire began on Chimney Tops. The fire broke out around 6:30 a.m. at the mall on the Parkway in downtown Gatlinburg. Gusts above 40 continued until 2 a.m. on Tuesday when they mostly dropped below 20 mph for the rest of the day. Some of those GSMNP personnel were trained out west and know how fast a wildfire spreads in high winds. That said, it is always easier for those outside of the forest to see the big picture then those who are standing inside the trees down on the forest floor. At least that is my understanding. Managers may need to keep resources in reserve for initial attack on new fires rather than a Hit it with all you have the Moment it breaks out. strategy. Ive been told by others that they were waiting for the rain to move in based on the forecast and it didnt arrive when they expected so in the meantime they did nothing. I told her my concerns of fire, traffic, and falling trees blocking flow of traffic were there an emergency. Chief Kurtz was right on target to compare South Canyon, Yarnell, and now Chimney Top 2. In my eyes, TEMA should have taken control of the situation and ordered evacuations before sunset. There were cliffs in the area but firefighting Hotshot Crews can figure out how to work on steep slopes, sometimes backing off a bit, constructing a fire line and intentionally burning the fuel in between, preventing further expansion of the fire. Once again the County and the City is sitting around twiddling their thumbs and doing nothing just like they did when the fire started and they could have contained it. She said smoke had been super heavy. Ash move in quickly after a fire, and through the yearly process of shedding their leaves, make it difficult for seeds from the Red Spruce/Fraser Fir/Hemlocks to make an effective seed-soil contact, thus when we lose one of these magnificent evergreen forests, it truly is a tragedy in more ways than one. They were taught with classroom didactic and hands on training, by sharing of lessons learned by others, and the best learning opportunity available, the best teacher of all; the actual experience itself. I do remember the bad fires in the 1990s in Florida and Colorado (I was in Glenwood Springs at a week-long seminar only a week after the Storm King Mountain aka South Canyon fire). Thanks Henry. We warned them about the approaching fire before turning the opposite direction to proceed on downtown. Another 2.3 inches accumulated that day by the time it stopped at 7 p.m. For example politicians far away from the event make decisions regarding funding, resources and operations. I know as I have been there many times due to security interests. For reference, 600 or above would indicate severe drought andincreased wildfire occurrence. Dollywood flat out refused to even consider we needed any help and also tried to shame our neighbor to discourage home not to take it. The park needs to share accountability in this situation, and all of us who have formerly worked in fire realize this. I agree with you Bill that it isnt Most but whether it is a few or many isnt the point for me. If the NPS backfires were not ignited on the 28th; then they had to be ignited on the 27th a day before the fire broke out. We watched local news and weather forecasts. But the NPS didnt even follow their own rules in this case. The city and the county has always been about one thing. I later learned that Sevier County pays for an emergency notification system called Code Red Alert. (The fire was in eastern Tennessee near the North Carolina border.). IMT issued pre-evacuation notices in GA and NC each time they saw cold-front winds approaching that could would threaten communities. Were here to rally and support those people until they can get back up on their feet, said Laura Rippetoe of the Gatlinburg Inn. May all the people find peace and forgiveness in the midst of this storm. It must have been Sunday, because a Type 1 team came in on Tuesday. Experience must be coupled with training and planning based on forecasted possibilities and even un-forecasted what ifs. Nonetheless, it is obvious to some folks that the NPS did not act aggressive enough on this fire. Given the wind forecast, pre-evac notice should have gone out on Sunday, Monday morning at latest. I am not holding my breath. The Incident Management Teams fighting fires in GA and NC gave pre-evac notices for people within 10 miles of the fire line each time a cold front with high winds approached. A club . They should not be excused because they did not escape the consequences this time of their lax policies and their actual failure to follow the procedures they should have followed. Under ideal conditions they can temporarily slow the spread, which may be effective if firefighters on the ground can move in quickly totake advantage of the short termchange in fire behavior by constructing firelines, stopping the spread at that location.